Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby nassir49 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:10 pm

Dear James

With regards to the Abtirsi of the Sheekhaal Clan on your website not only its wrong but its significantly flawed, you need to go back to your list and correct the genealogy you listed. some of your lists are correct, for example


Aw Qutub
Aw Axmed (Loobage)
Aw Cismaan (Gandarshe)
Jaziira (Bah Xassan)
Qallu
Teedan
Abiib
Gudle
Cabdi-Sheikh
Cabdi-Sufi
Cali (Sheekh Liibaan
Similar details are also available on wikipedia *just google sheekhaal* and you should find it, also you need to know that the AW qutub, Cali sheikh, and the Qallu subclans and others do not subscribe to the notion that they are part of Hawiye clan, however like their Ahmed loobage sublcan they do not object the political alignment with Hawiye. also its widely believed that the Sheekhal clans were reportedly not considered as part of the Hawiye until after the civil war see http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=lAyeNqKK7bQC&lpg=PA1&pg=PA140&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby James Dahl » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:35 pm

Dear nassir49,

Sheekhaal were an integral part of the Hiraab imamate going back 400 years, but if you still have doubts, I know some Sheekhaal who did the genetic genealogy test and Sheekhaal are closest related to Habar Gidir and Abgaal, as they should be as Martiile Hiraab.

The argument I believe is that some Sheekhaal say their Fiqi Cumar is the other Fiqi Cumar, the Sheekhaash Fiqi Cumar who is descended from Abu Bakr.
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby loobage » Sat Jan 21, 2012 6:46 pm

I finally got hold of some elders and it seems Nassir is right. Shiiqaal were hijack in 1991.

Nasir, information on our clan is not displayed correctly on wikipedia.
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby nassir49 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:36 am

James Dahl wrote:Dear nassir49,

Sheekhaal were an integral part of the Hiraab imamate going back 400 years, but if you still have doubts, I know some Sheekhaal who did the genetic genealogy test and Sheekhaal are closest related to Habar Gidir and Abgaal, as they should be as Martiile Hiraab.

The argument I believe is that some Sheekhaal say their Fiqi Cumar is the other Fiqi Cumar, the Sheekhaash Fiqi Cumar who is descended from Abu Bakr.


Haaa,Haaa you must be kidding me, what genealogy test you are talking about? it seems to me that you and loobage are relaying on word of mouth and your personal instincts, in order to achieve your own objectives, the literature written about Sheekhaal, or Sheekhaash or faqi/fiqi Cumar suggest otherwise. there is no doubt there strong political relationship between loobage subclan and the Hawiye clan, but the notion that Sheekhaals are part of Hawiye is flawed. its like one saying that Reerow Xassan are part of sheekhaal, which they are not even though majority of Somalis believe this. and finally your data base is very contradicting, hence your efforts are worthless.
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby nassir49 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:40 am

loobage wrote:I finally got hold of some elders and it seems Nassir is right. Shiiqaal were hijack in 1991.

Nasir, information on our clan is not displayed correctly on wikipedia.


Well, the information on Wikipedia would be more convincing to people,then the information on this data base which is flawed and contradicting.
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby James Dahl » Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:43 am

To be honest I am sceptical of any claim to Arabian ancestry, especially people tracing to Abu Talib or Abu Bakr.
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby Mad-Hatter » Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:46 pm

So you would rather ignore us and not change it. On what grounds?
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby James Dahl » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:11 pm

Mad-Hatter wrote:So you would rather ignore us and not change it. On what grounds?


Dear Mad-Hatter,

No, that's not how it is, look people who know much more than I do have written on the subject extensively.

Fiqi ʿUmar was the son of Shaykh Khadbale Shaykh Saʿad and his mother Faduma Mahdi, who was the granddaughter of Fiqi ʿUmar Fiqi Shamsi, who claims descent from Abu Bakr al-Siddiq.

This is how Sheekhaal is descended from Abu Bakr. Paternally, Shaykh Khadbale Shaykh Saʿad was Martiile Hiraab, which makes Sheekhaal Martiile Hiraab.

I am sceptical of Fiqi ʿUmar Fiqi Shamsi's claims of Arabian descent, especially from Abu Bakr of all people, but this is irrelevant to Sheekhaal because this isn't via their father anyways.
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby milka » Wed Oct 01, 2014 2:44 am

It is important to mention that Aw qutub and Loobage both Agree that they are family regardless of Hiraab or not.
I am Loobage from Mugadisho and was under the impretion that we are Habiye. However, to my surprice, My Loobage elders informed me that we are not Hiraab by blood but only in politics. They are in complete agreement with Awqutub and that we are the decendants of Abubakar (Radyallahu anhu).

Also to note, Caagane is a subclan of Loobage. I am Caagane, Loobage, Shiiqaal.
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Re: Sheekhaal/Faqi Omar Abtirsi

Postby James Dahl » Tue Oct 14, 2014 2:41 am

I will consolidate Sheekhaal under Abadir. I don't understand all the details but if Sheekhaal all agree that's good enough for me.

I will try and figure this out later.
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